Lavinia, I totally agree
(However, when someone is thinking of moving here from the UK and asks questions about education or health care, for example, it is hard for us not to compare the two cultures.)
Then it is only sensible to answer and compare, ...but as for the other comments always arising, it gets me mad.
Thank you for your replies Graham and Jules
Kathyx
Message posted by kathy3 on 14 November 2011 at 2:02pm - IP Logged
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And another point is this, yes the young people do misbehave in Kavos, but if they could not get all the cheap drink, they would not go there, so never mind videoing them, both sides must take the blame here. The Greeks for starting all of this in the first place, and the youngsters for not behaving responsibly.
Kavos is known for it, the Greek people run the bars so it is up to them to put an end to this, if they do not want it they do not need to put up with it. I have visited many Greek resorts, and there are a mixture of age groups, and everyone is happy ... but I remember Spain had somewhere like that, and in the end they got so fed up, they cleaned up the place and it is now a place to go to for everyone.
kathyxx
Message posted by DavidJ on 14 November 2011 at 5:55pm - IP Logged
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I wouldn't deny that a lot of Greeks work hard but you can't argue with the fact that tax evasion is the national sport. I spoke to a friend in Athens who is up in arms about the one-off wealth tax but freely admits that he hasn't paid any income tax in 15 years. And you can't blame the EU for letting Greece get away with it - Greeks have to take resposnsibility for their own actions and those of their government. There is no doubt that successive Greek goverenments have cooked the books (i.e. lied) to maintain their EU membership (claiming inflation of 3% when ite been nearer 14% by manipulating the figures for example.) And now its all come back to haunt them and they're blaming everyone else except themselves. Recommended Reading: the chapter on Greece in Boomerang - the Meltdown Tour by Michael Lewis.
Message posted by Graham T-A on 14 November 2011 at 9:58pm - IP Logged
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David, you are missing something here. The Greeks don't see that they are telling fibs. That's their government, not them, even though they encouraged the lies. They also don't see that they are getting money from Europe. The way they see it is that they are part of the EU and so its their money anyway (the way Greek families think about what their familys own) which is paying off their debts so they are being victimised for something they did not do. The Greek press are putting a slant on the present problem which is worse than the daily UK press could ever get away with which pleases the population as they still don't see that they have ever done anything wrong.
Message posted by kathy3 on 15 November 2011 at 8:18am - IP Logged
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On the last two posts. If they do not take some of the blame, how will they ever get out of the mess they are in? They have got to acknowledge the country is in a mess, it is a sorry state of affairs indeed I think
kathyx
Message posted by Graham T-A on 15 November 2011 at 10:43am - IP Logged
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I was up thee Kafenion a couple of nights ago and it's everyone elses fault but certainly not their own. I pointed out that while they claiming their winter money EKA from the state for being unemployed they were all in fact working on other jobs and not paying taxes. They could not see that this may be something to do with the problem.
Message posted by kathy3 on 15 November 2011 at 11:12am - IP Logged
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I have deliberately kept away from this topic but having now watched the documentary I feel that I am now in a position to offer my two leptasworth. I also base my views on ten years of living in Greece.
Firstly the programme itself was, in my opinion, reasonably factual. I saw nothing that I thought to be incorrect. The reporting was as mentioned in other replies typically 'tabloid' and sensationalist.
With the exception of the doctor and planning officer scenarios, nothing was shown that was illegal insofar as the individuals were concerned, as far as I recall.
The programme would have been improved by more explanation of why these situations have come about. There was only one reference to these reasons which was glossed over.
Lavinia, I fully understand your defence of the medical profession but I can assure you that it goes on.
I have personally experienced it. When coming to pay for the removal of some sea urchin spines from my granddaughter's foot, I was given three prices. The highest was if I was putting it through insurance; the next highest was if I wanted a receipt and the cheapest was if I paid cash without a receipt.
A recent consultation with a vet resulted in a bill for the consultation and prescription drugs. Only the cost of the drugs appeared on the receipt.
If I go back to the programme, the 'perks' that were on offer were legitimate. For example the classification of hairdressing as a hazardous occupation. That is not the fault of the recipient.
In the same way that MPs were accused in the UK of abusing the expenses system. Few were actually found to have been proven to have done anything illegal. Those few that were, have been dealt with.
On a personal note, when I was working, there were occasions that I was entitled to a subsistence allowance whether or not I spent the money in the first place, just so long as I met the criteria. (Eg away from my normal place of work for more than a specified time).
Morally, it may not be right but legally it was. Yes, before anyone queries it I claimed it every time!
Bob G
Message posted by Mrs D on 15 November 2011 at 5:54pm - IP Logged
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I would just like to add my own comments in relation this topic.
I, along with my husband purchased our wee house to renovate back in 2004. The cost of the work, which has been paid mainly in cash, has far outweighed what it would have cost for the same work to be done in the UK. If wages are so low and tax is not being paid (alledgedly), where has all this money gone? In the UK traditionally cash jobs are much cheaper to the customer but in Corfu, despite the fact that I paid for the majority of the work in cash, the price was still very expensive! Somebody, somewhere along the line, has done quite well out of our project.
Oh and by the way before anyone asks why I paid in cash, I generally wasn't given any choice.
Message posted by DavidJ on 15 November 2011 at 7:03pm - IP Logged
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Graham T- A I suspect you're right - the Greeks don't think they're telling fibs and they look at it as their money - and therein lies the problem- they're in total denial!
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